Obama's health bill

[Rick Williamson]

I will say it again. It's NOT anywhere near being a bad system. There are a few things that need changing like putting a cap on how much the lawyers can go after in a law suit. Congress will not touch that one because of all the lawyers in the congress. About half of those BO wants to cover are illegal in this country! I for one don't want some dumb ass committee in Washington telling me and my Doctor what can be done and what can't. Or that I'm to old for that pacemaker or whatever because of the cost. And I for sure don't want to be forced into his gov. plan. Or Taxed on the cost of my heath care package at work. I'm like 85% of the country that is happy with their insurance plan. So leave it alone! And YES I too would like to see the cost go down. But to do that we don't need to do a total make over that is run by the gov. I don't want the gov. to control me from birth to death. I want my freedoms left alone! To many people over the years have died for these freedoms.

[Rick Williamson]

Ok let's take this one. I have just 3 questions for you ---

1: HOW did they get there? and
2: HOW is it my fault?
3: WHY do I have to pay for it?

If you want to help them why aren't you giving them money? Why aren't they going to their church and asking for help? My church has funds for people who are temporarily behind the 8-ball.

What are they doing to change the situation?

I know one thing - it could be me who is in that situation some day, very easily. But am I going to whine that it's the "government's responsibility" to take care of me? That I am "entitled" to free healthcare?

I sure hope not.

I think Jesus said it best (and I paraphrase) - give a man a fish he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for life.

Amen brother!

[AJ14]

John , it isn't really a question of them " getting " anywhere . I hope you won't be surprised to know that a take home paycheck of three or four hundred per person per week is quite common . In fact there are people who work more than forty hours a week who don't even do that well . How much do you imagine the counter man at AutoZone makes ? How much would you think the average lawm maintenence man makes . There are millions upon millions of people who would call those wages normal . And in the example i gave , i hardly think we could call their style of living plush . They do alright , they keep their heads above water . But there is no room at all in the budget for health insurance in its present form . Now thats certainly not their fault , but it isn't yours or mine either . So using this family and the millions just like them as an example , whats the solution ? Should they just simply have to do without since they can't afford it ? If the wife needs an operation , or one of the children breaks a leg or contracts diabetes there're just out of luck ? Or do they go to the emergency room , which you and i end up paying for anyway . And should they have health care that would allow them to see a doctor for check-ups regularly so that really major health problems could be caught before they become major ? We live in a country that shouldn't allow anyone to suffer or die only because they can't afford to do anything else . And while i agree there are a lot of people choose their own health by the crap food they eat , there are even more who do nothing wrong except not making enough money .

[Edm]

$300 a month for insurance for a family, thats pretty damn good. We pay $800 a month for myself mid 30s good health, non smoker, my wife 26, non smoker and good health and our new born. We researched for several months before we picked this insurance and we are happy with it. Why should I have to pay more taxes for insurance when we already pay for our own? As a business owner I DO NOT WANT TO PAY MORE TAXES THEN I ALREADY DO. I DID NOT VOTE FOR THAT!!!! I will fight anyone at the drop of a hat over this issue. Me and my wife work too God dang hard and too many hours for the f...ed up government to take more from us. We are getting penalized for working hard every day trying to secure our future and our babies future.

[mizechris]

Are You Guys Kidding Me

You know when I was a teenager I went into a bar with my dad one time. While I was drinking a pop (soda) I said to my dad's friend, "who are you voting for next week?" My dad quickly grabbed me up and took me off to the side. He told me 2 things you don't talk about in a bar. Religion and POLITICS. Maybe we should treat this board as a bar. LOL
Not everyone will agree on a way to fix health care. Rick you have to be blind to see that there are not some big problems way it is.
John you suprise me the most. If you go to the church you say helps people then I am sure evry Sunday you throw money in the little basket that comes around. So what you are saying is that because Uncle Sam might want to help people it is wrong because you pay for it to. BUT yet I am sure you throw money in that basket yet have no problem when that money gets used to help someone. That confusses me.
Bush fans or should I say Democrat haters in general will disagree with everything that is put up right now. You act as if Obama and the Dems are the devil himself. Let us not forget what Bush did in this country. All the back door secrets him and his VP did. You want to talk about someone making it like Russia. And I also have done research on that. But when that is brought up all you can say is OBAMA is killing this country. SIX FRICKIN MONTHS is all he has been in. Maybe if your beloved BUSH didn't have 8 years to do what he did we wouldn't be having this discussion. Once I would like to see a Republican say Bush screwed it up. He was bad. Never happen. Your nature is to point a finger and say it was the Dems fault. FACE FACTS AND REALIZE. IT IS ALL THE POLITITIONS FAULT. DEMS AND REP.

Health care is needed and this plan needs to be looked at. Most of the people bitching about it are they same ones yank medicare card out and go to the mailbox once a month to get ss check I pay for. Maybe we should just cut that to.

[bubba]

The reality is whether the concern over fellow man that is expressed in every major religion I have heard of is just lip service or if people really mean it.

I think Tenney's comment about teaching a man to fish is right on target, but in order for him to listen to your teachings, he can't be doubled over from an illness he is too poor to treat.

You gotta drag the bottom of the stack along for the ride or the top of the pile aint gonna rise either. Everybody wants to live in a vaccuum as if lazy/stupid/(insert other terms used on this thread here) don't exist and that their impact on our economy is negligible. Nobody wants to spend money on education/healthcare/etc, the very things that can improve our quality of life - because they are afraid someone who in their eyes doesn't deserve it will get a piece of the pie they paid for.

[Edm]

Isn't this something that should have been sorted out before the stimulus money was GIVEN away? Have any of you looked at what some of this money has gone too? Millions of dollars have gone to PRIVATE air strips, roads and bridges amongst many other useless projects that really didn't need it. This money could have been directed toward some of the health care problems. Where is all that money coming from? WAKE THE HELL UP!!! I think this person that was put in office is really hurting us, our childrens and grand childrens future.

[bubba]

Do you think he personally assigned money to whatever projects you are talking about or do you think maybe just maybe the same fine folks in congress got their fat little hands on it?

The worst thing that could have happened to our society is that we did nothing at the time our entire financial market was crumbling - literally days/hours away from failure. Perfect move? No, but it is working. The DOW is over 9000 and things have settled down, not great, but not fake gains like the other bubbles created by the newly rich in our society that profited from the faulty subprime mortgage/tech/construction booms.

[Edm]

No but at the time the money was being handed out there was supposed to be a committee to over see everything to keep mistakes like this from happening. It pisses me off to no end. The future of me and my family is being F...ed with and I am not happy about it. I don't think hand outs are the way and I hope that hard work and dedication will still prevail.

[DeMan951]

You know when I was a teenager I went into a bar with my dad one time. While I was drinking a pop (soda) I said to my dad's friend, "who are you voting for next week?" My dad quickly grabbed me up and took me off to the side. He told me 2 things you don't talk about in a bar. Religion and POLITICS. Maybe we should treat this board as a bar. LOL
Not everyone will agree on a way to fix health care. Rick you have to be blind to see that there are not some big problems way it is.
John you surprise me the most. If you go to the church you say helps people then I am sure every Sunday you throw money in the little basket that comes around. So what you are saying is that because Uncle Sam might want to help people it is wrong because you pay for it to. BUT yet I am sure you throw money in that basket yet have no problem when that money gets used to help someone. That confuses me.

Very good points.

I am fortunate to work two jobs right now with today's economy. My first one supplies benefits and they have gone from being free for me to now having to pay out of my own pocket to stay on their plan and it goes up more and more each year. Now my second job (ACE Hardware) does not. I work with some very nice hardworking people there, and with what they make their is no way that they can afford to get health insurance. Should they just be forgotten because they didn't get the education to get a job that supplies health insurance?

[tedrichard]

Winger - NOT well said but agrees with the popular trash in American media.

Every American can afford health care, they just choose not to.

Of the three million or so who are not covered by any plan (yes 3 million, not 47 as the media says) all own TVs, cable, and cell phones.

It's priorities.

Typical republican BS! Let me tell YOU something. I own a cell phone, I own a tv and yes I even have cable. AND internet. And I have an employer provided health care plan that I pay about $400 a month for that gives me a $5000 deductible. I can NOT afford to have my wife on it, OR the 2 grandkids that we have to care for because their mom can't. It's a LITTLE bit more than a priority issue. What I pay for the "luxuries" that you mention are a drop in the bucket as to what REAL health care costs! I am hanging over the precipice of bankruptcy by a very thin thread! A $5k deductible to me may as well be $5 MILLION and that would be $5k per PERSON even if I COULD afford to put the rest of the family on it. Why don't you walk a mile in MY shoes and see what health care looks like to ME? Yeah, I know, you're a red blooded hard working American Dreamer who started out without 2 nickles to rub together and you worked hard for what you've got......Well, so did I!! I spent MY whole liife working for a paycheck signed by guys like YOU who expect to get top dollar for everything that YOU do and pay as little as humanly possible to the poor bastards who supply YOUR goods and services!! Maybe you did a little better at it than I did! Does that mean that I don't deserve health care, OR my wife who's busted HER butt all her life too, OR my grandkids????? Why do they let politics get onto this forum anyway??? As far as I'm concerned, talk racing all you want to, but leave your politics and religion at the door!!

[FLQuacker]

Simply stated...this is the war that is being waged in the US right now.

Those that can pay more taxes to provide for those that can't.

Any liberal politician will tell you, your JOB is to provide taxes to the Gov't to sustain itself and those that rely on it.

Which by design, under the current administration, seeks to make the majority.

That is the requirement for this continued path.

Are people naive enough to believe the "reform" stops with Health care?

[tedrichard]

You know, it's all a matter of perspective. The view depends on what rung of the ladder you're hanging on to. It's all relative. I will flat guarantee you the anybody who has the "I worked for MINE and to hell with anybody who wants to take anything away from ME" attitude is going to tell you that "If you've got enough money to afford (enter whatever floats your boat here) then you've just plain assed got too much money and need to give ME some! As far as I'm concerned if you want to share in the fruits that our society has produced then you need to share in the TRUE costs of the system that GENERATES those fruits, and that includes all of the less fortunate than you who toil for low wages so you can AFFORD all of your goodies. We live in a country that provides virtually unlimited luxuries and a fabulous standard of living for the privliged, talented or just plain lucky and we can DAMNED sure provide at least the BASIC neccesities of life to ALL of our members who participate in keeping the system functioning and those who are not fortunate enough to be capable of working.

[FLQuacker]

This Utopia you envision...can be found at many places only a short airline ride away.

Please visit, and report back how well a Government can provide for all those basic necessities of life to ALL it's citizens.

[Todd McCreary]

Health care in the US in among the lowest rated in the world now, for developed countries.

pure bullshit. any ranking which places Cuba ahead of or equal to the United States is worthless on it's face. and you need to explain why Canadians stream across the border ( sometimes paid for by their own socialized health care system ) to access American doctors and hospitals.

that's like giving Al Gore a Nobel prize. by doing so, they have betrayed that their own political biases and agenda are far more important to them than any objective measure and they're willing to lie about everything.





The view depends on what rung of the ladder you're hanging on to.

yeah? i grew up in a trailer park. i'm poor white trash ( you notice i can't afford very many capital letters? ) and probably always will be.

that doesn't mean i can't recognize skeezy little slimeballs who are trying to screw everybody else over while trying to get a better place slopping at the trough.