Have racecars become boring?

[Frasson118]

I found a great article about one mans opinion of why racing might be on a decline. Younger fans won't get this at all, but for us older fans, this guy hits it square on the head. It takes a while to read, and is based upon Modifieds in the Northeast, but what he says is very applicable to what we have going on here too. Well worth the time to read... especially for Promoters!

http://3widespicturevault.com/FRONT%.../Real_Deal.htm

[Boneman]

I have not read the article Jerry, but I have thought for years that one of the things that diminishes the entertainment value in short tracking is aerodynamics. Hear me out on this one.

I remember very fondly the "old days" when cars in most classes came out with substantial bumpers on the front and rear. They were not just decorations either, that iron was used every night. To me, racecars look better that way. The fans saw tough cars that were ready for action.

Most importantly, overall the races were better too.

Modern aero noses, fenders and bumper covers are more work to fabricate, install and maintain than bumpers. They are found on nearly every class now. Why? Don't tell me its because they make the cars faster. Obviously they do, but if everyone has the same advantage then why put everyone through the trouble? I'd rather see a better race where the cars run just a few tenths slower.

Here are a few examples of classes that are unquestioned success stories. Legends have old school bumpers and no sleek aero bodies. There are lots of reasons why this class is popular, but I guarantee that minimal body work and close racing have to be considerations.

Here me out: consider the cars that race at Crash A Rama. They are crowd favorites! I am referring to the cars COVERED with bumpers, guard rails and re-inforcements. When the fans see them, they expect wild action...and the racers with their tough cars deliver it.

Lets take a step backwards, particularly in the lower and mid-level classes, to make racing a little cheaper, a little easier, and I believe more entertaining. Off with the noses! On with the bumpers!

[HaudFan]

I think most of us remember watching the Chris Economacki interview on SPEED about this time last year. And his words still echo in my head,"what killed midget racing in America was there were some many different groups running them and all the cars became the same." Just look at the PRI Race from last Friday. The cars were so equal almost no passing...Everytime I go to a local short track I always say,"how many Monte Carlos did Chevy make?"

Just like the article said, the cars have lost their identity and the technology has made average racers, champions.

[tedrichard]

I think most of us remember watching the Chris Economacki interview on SPEED about this time last year. And his words still echo in my head,"what killed midget racing in America was there were some many different groups running them and all the cars became the same." Just look at the PRI Race from last Friday. The cars were so equal almost no passing...Everytime I go to a local short track I always say,"how many Monte Carlos did Chevy make?"

Just like the article said, the cars have lost their identity and the technology has made average racers, champions.

Amen buddy! Parity SUCKS! Make 'em hard to drive and put talent, skill and experince back in the game again!

[hanley_72]

Bring back Jr. Hanley and some of his creations. Dr. Hanleystein is one of them. SLM with big spoilers on the back and long sleek fronts.
Everthing is cookie cutter these days. Get guys who can set up drive and just outdrive other guys or gals.

[Razpewton]

Tis true...

Some of today's cars have spoiled their drivers. There's no disclipline....

[Joe]

Absolutely. They're kind of like great looking women with no real personality. Sexy? Yes, but I wouldn't want to spend more than 20 minutes with one.

[Rick Williamson]

The same thing can be said for Nascar now and then.

[fred23]

My dad and I were talking after seeing the 'Vintage" cars at Orlando a couple of years ago how cool it would be if we could put an old 57 chevy body on his sportsman. He ran back in the 60's and hates how all of the cars look the same.
He tried to be different this year and put a creative body on his car only to have it ripped apart by the tech people and ended up having to put on conforming parts.
I know 5 star or ARP or even Lightning Light could make some vintage body styles. The fans would get a kick out of it and would not keep having to ask what class is racing because they all look alike.

[Todd McCreary]

you know, all the "great looking" race cars in the world won't do you any good if you can't get the show off in a timely fashion ... or even keep it moving.

last Saturday the heat order ended with Outlaw Strictly Stocks and 2 heats of Hurricanes/Strictly Stocks. now, the Outlaws only have 4 cars total. and they still couldn't manage to get lined up in time to head out for their race. not a single one of them. they had ~10 heats to get ready and they still coudn't get their act together.

so OSW did what they had to do and threw the first heat of Hurricanes on the track. of course, the 1st Hurricane heat was way short ( only 6 cars ) ... because they were leapfrogging in a race earlier than they should have.

while they ran, the Outlaws finally straggled in, mixed in with the Hurricanes lining up for their 2nd heat.

here's where i have a problem: the Outlaws were put on the track to run their heat between the Hurricane heats. there were no consequences for screwing the pooch like they did ( their heat should have been cancelled ). in fact they, with their 4 car field, two of whom don't do anything but get lapped, got rewarded with a 20 lap feature.

while the Hurricanes/Strictlies, with 20 cars and all kinds of passing ( except for Casey, for which i apologize ... if he ever gets in my car again he starts at the back. yes, even if Jane says otherwise ), get rewarded with 15 laps and being held til the last race of the night.

now, i understand that OSW considers "Winter Heat" to be a club night and that this kind of thing isn't going to get fixed in the off season but you really need to consider what you're going to be doing next year.

if you're not going to do anything about getting the show done at a reasonable hour ( 10:30 at the latest ) the least you can do is give laps to the classes that give you full fields ( 20 laps for 2 SLM's? ) and let them get their races in earlier. and not just for them, for the fans who are actually paying to put their butts in your stands.

[Boneman]

What a bunch of hot air

Make 'em hard to drive and put talent, skill and experince back in the game again!

There is no going back. We all like to think that our childhood driving heros were the best and the baddest, but the fact is everyone is a lot faster now. Yes, I realize that technology makes it much easier, but don't you see that todays winners ARE talented and skilled? It is never easy for anyone to win. Modern, winning racers have a much deeper understanding of chassis and set-ups than racers in the past when only a few knew what was going on. You cannot legislate away that understanding.

"Make 'em hard to drive", what do you mean by that? 8" tires on a SLM? Yeah, that would be hard to drive, but it is too silly of an idea to take seriously. Standardize the suspension design to something less sophisticated and slower? That eliminates the design advantage of racers who tinker, and it leads back to the dreaded parity problem. Open up the motors? Too expensive. Restrict the motors. Wrong again, it leads to parity.

If the cars are "too easy to drive", then I suggest changing classes. No driver is going to claim that a winged sprint like the TBARA is easy to drive. Their races are structured so that the winners and high point drivers start 4 or 5 rows back and have to get to the front in 25 laps.

More open wheel rocket ships and fewer taxi cabs. That would improve the sport!

[tedrichard]

[QUOTE=Boneman;2128:
"Make 'em hard to drive", what do you mean by that? 8" tires on a SLM? Yeah, that would be hard to drive, but it is too silly of an idea to take seriously.

Really? Well, you might want to tell that to Nascar. They've been running narrow rubber on the cup cars since the 70's. I agree you can't put the genie (of technology) back in the bottle again. But you can indeed limit the benefits of tech by intelligent design and rules. It is my opinion that the formula for putting excitement back in racing again includes, in simplistic terms, "unhooking" the cars. There is nothing stupid about this idea, as you imply. Many classes already employ such a concept. Legends cars are just one of the examples. What you want is to keep the available traction WAY below the amount of power available. This does several things. For one, it diminishes the importance of getting every last ounce of horsepower from the engines. It also puts much less stress on the engine letting them live much longer. All of this speculation is pretty much an exersize in futility anyway. Like the guy in the article said, at the end of the day, racing as we dinosaurs knew it is living on borrowed time and is nearing the end of the road. You can't expect us to just sit around and watch it die without so much as an idle comment.
Oh, and by the way, the tone of your message, implying that my ideas are stupid, comes perilously close to the definition of a "flame". Imply? No, you pretty much flat came out and said it. "too silly of an idea to take seriously."
Those were your words.

[Rick Williamson]

I think something that would help is. Do like Auburndale does. The top 3 at the finish of the race this week goes to the REAR next week. I would say if you have 20 or more cars in a class spot the top 3 back to 16th, 17th and 18th. The Southern Sportsmen Series the first year had the winner of the last race start 19th. Then they moved it to 11th the next 2 years. Then this past year Fascar removed the rule all together. There by letting the winner this race have a chance to pull the #1 spot the very next race. How unfair is that? You end up with a fastest group of cars always being near the top. This is not a fix all. But for racings sack do something to get a better fix of cars. Then you would have, dare I say it ..........passing again.

[hanley_72]

How about something like this 1991 Jr. Hanley white car up here in Ontario, Canada.

Or his more well known paint job like this one.

[Todd McCreary]

"Make 'em hard to drive", what do you mean by that? 8" tires on a SLM? Yeah, that would be hard to drive, but it is too silly of an idea to take seriously.

Open Wheel Modifieds already have engine rules that are WAY more wide open ( cube per pound of car weight and pretty much anything else goes ) than SLM rules and they seem to be getting by on 8" tires just fine.




If the cars are "too easy to drive", then I suggest changing classes. No driver is going to claim that a winged sprint like the TBARA is easy to drive.

easy to say ... as long as you're spending someone else's money. when you're funding it out of your own pocket that's a whole different kettle of fish.



Oh, and by the way, the tone of your message, implying that my ideas are stupid, comes perilously close to the definition of a "flame". Imply? No, you pretty much flat came out and said it. "too silly of an idea to take seriously."

come on now, take a deep breath. no need to nuke him just yet. we get more verbally rambunctious than this face to face in the pits. with people we like, even.



anybody else notice that consensus for inverting? i bet it would have improved the truck race a bunch if Gorham and the rest of the top 20 had started from the back. we'd also find out who can drive. 200 laps is plenty of time for a good driver with a good car to make something happen.

not that i'm saying Gorham can't drive, he just didn't have to prove it Sat night. aside from avoiding backmarkers, he was pretty much just turning qualifying laps.