(spoiler alert) 2019 Advance Auto Parts Clash (or Crash, if you prefer)

[OldSchool+]

Gettin' pretty close to six...

[Lurkin]

One problem they could easily fix, and I thought they had but they haven't, is the cars yaw'd out to the left to get the spoiler out of the air. Some have it a lot and some have it a little but none of them are running the wheelbase square. I'd bet the 21 was yaw'd out to the max allowed, one reason it was fast, and so when the air pulled on him the wheelbase wanted to go that way too, not straight ahead like it would if the wheelbase was the same on both sides.

[OldSchool+]

Good point, Lurkin.

It seems inherently counterintuitive to let them do that.

And between the yaw and positive LF camber (another practice that could be easily mandated away), once a car heads to the right it is hard to get it back. Whether caused by
"air" or over-correction...

Let's see, I think this is the order of events:

1) The cars are too fast and aero unstable at high speed
2) Lets slow them down and create more problems with restrictor plates
3) NOW, lets allow them to run soft springs and unequal wheelbase to, um, get the rear spoiler out of the air.

4) So they are unstable?!?

NASCAR has complete control of the plates. At the very least the cars should be as stable as possible and then the plates sized appropriately to achieve the speed target they are after.

Some things are just hard to figger.

[jacko241]

Lurkin is right, and they just look stupid crab walking down the track. I feel the same way about the dirt late models now, with that damn lift bar setup or whatever the hell it is. I wouldn't run one just because they look ridiculous, and have no interest in watching them.

[OldSchool+]

And now...

The "It will never happen" department:
Joe, they could kill all of the following birds with one stone:

>Have better Racing
>Generate increased interest
>Eliminate plates
>Eliminate Bump Drafting
>Eliminate boring races
>Not have to modify the precious banking
And if IMSA is a partial clue, perhaps most importantly
>Add that ulta desirable european/austrailian/international flair!

By...running Charlotte-style roval races exclusively at Daytona, Talladega, Indy, and Pocono. Especially if...

"It will never happen pt II":

I would suggest there is room for significant improvement in infield/roadcourse design. Seems like currently they mostly narrow & flat (ie, cheap). There is no reason infield courses could not be permanent and dedicated, with short track-like banking, and short track-like straights in between the turns, complete with short track-like walls and SAFER barriers.

And, of course, if the track was exciting enough, they could have additional dedicated, pay-by-the-seat grandstands as well.


It seems affordable and do-able, yet impossible at the same time.

[Lurkin]

Ha ha that's exactly what I call it, stupid crab walking. I disagree with the dirt lm stuff though. It's hard to dislike something like that when they're still racing side by side. Street stocks falling over to the right like that look stupid to me but not LM's.

[jacko241]

You certainly cannot argue with the racing on dirt, they put on a show, I just don't like how the cars look now.

[OldSchool+]

Give it a shot, Joe. You might get a "rise" out of it.

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...eUDuyswRhu-dM:

[Lurkin]

Truck race was the same. A bunch of so called professionals weaving around like they're drunk, trying to go straight. smdh

[jacko241]

Lurkin, could you believe that mess?? I think there were 8 trucks running at the finish, and almost all of them had some damage. I guess I am wrong about lower speeds making better racing. I am beginning to believe it is the video game culture of these kids that are now making up the bulk of the drivers.

[OldSchool+]

It's de track, boss, de track

https://www.google.com/search?q=plea...RIGcO-0B1w2iM:

When we used to go go-cart "racing" on a short, greased oval our "rule" was--whoever got in front went a tick artificially slow and blocked. Result? bang bang bang two wide.

Man was it fun.

Same-same at restrictor plate races. They cannot get away from each other.

And Cup has about got them 3 feet apart with 30+ years of attacking the unsolvable problem and voila', it's either crashing or boring.

Those guys would look good on a short track--in fact, Mike Skinner (former truck driver) currently does look good at New Smyrna. But running with essentially go-cart governors at 180+ just produces predictable results.

They have got their series talent level pretty clearly laid out:

ARCA--maximum driver errors
Truck--slightly fewer errors
Xfinity--better still
Cup--sucks the least!

Yay.

"Daytona 500--NASCAR's biggest event of the year".

By NASCAR's measure, anyway...

[jacko241]

So, simply put, why didn't it happen in the good old days?

[OldSchool+]

You know me...it's seldom simply put .

Two major factors:

1) They slowly gained in technology and speed. While they were getting there, the cars looked and raced about like they did at Charlotte. There were only about six "fast" cars, but you knew they were on the edge of crashing and they were doing, say, 170 instead of last years 165, so it was thrilling in and of itself. Even the "independents", probably 10-15 mph off the pace, were hauling the mail in their own right, on the verge of crashing, and also thrilling to watch.

2) They were on belted tires. Drifters are lightweights. Those dudes were sideways--constantly-- in cars with door handles and vent windows, with minimal cages and seats.

The danger was something almost tangible, and itself kept you on the edge of your seat.

Back in those days, it often came down to a two car battle, and a last lap backstretch slingshot move--or not. It often worked, and when it didn't you had the Petty/Pearson and Allsion/Yarborough deals.

And then, when they got to about 200, they were running Monte Carlos with no flaps, no roof fins, and a big A low pressure area behind the near vertical back window, and this happened:

https://youtu.be/2MQGyfPkIt8?t=5

Note the car rolls over the "wrong" way. Cale's car was not the last to do this, and clearly, a car could gain altitude, clear the fence, and take out dozens, if not hundreds, of fans.

Rather than face the lawsuits and probably a government racing ban, along came a simple chunk of aluminum that the inspectors could understand, and with holes that could and did become smaller and smaller.

And everything else is a by product of that.

Fairly simply put after all, but not brief...

[OldSchool+]

I went to Citrus Co. last night. Great racing. No plates. No pack racing. No chance of a car flying into the stands. Somewhere between that 1/3 mile or so venue and 2.5 mile the point of diminishing returns is reached. I would suggest it is a long ways before 2.5 miles...

The fix is always a shorter and/or flatter track that itself prevents today's technology from reaching the critical airplane wing effect by holding the speed down.

And they just don't want to do that. It has been grumbled about for years, I think at one point by Jack Roush. But you know, it doesn't go well in the tech booth or announcer booth when one grumbles publicly about NASCAR.

So, they constantly get surprised by Mother Physics and we discuss it all.

I do not see an end in sight.

Racetime, 2:30!

[jacko241]

I agree about flattening the banking. You are right though, I don't see it happening. I don't agree that the speeds are at fault. They were going 200mph in the early 70's. The pole for the '70 500 was 194mph. They slowed them down for a few years but by 1979 they were back up to 196mph. We still did not see the ridiculous crashfests we see today.