Attn: All Tracks....wake Up!!...safety!! Safety!! Safety!!!

[1wildfastgirl24]

AFTER WHAT I AND ALOT OF OTHERS SADLY WITNESSED LAST NIGHT AT VSP,PLEASE! PLEASE! WAKE UP!! AND DO ROUTINE SAFETY INSPECTIONS ON EVERY CAR IN EVERY CLASS TO MAKE SURE ALL CAGES ARE SAFE,PROPERLY WELDED AND INSTALLED CORRECTLY TO THE FRAME OF THE CAR,MAKE SURE THE HARNESS BELTS THAT HOLD THE DRIVER IN THE SEAT ARE UP TO DATE AND EVERY PIECE OF IT IS THERE AND INSTALLED CORRECTLY,....ONE LIFE LOST IS TO MANY!! AND SOULD NEVER HAPPEN BECAUSE OF IT.SO PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!!!!!! HAVE YOUR OFFICIALS FOCUSE ON ALL SAFETY ISSUES ON EVERY CAR BEFORE THEY GET ON THE TRACK WITH IT.

[carolwicks]

Denise...

what happened and who? please post...
carolwicks aka OZ

[1wildfastgirl24]

The crash happened in the ump 4cyl pure stock division the last race of the night just as the checkered flag dropped...the #92 car was clipped in the rear by another car sending the #92 in a barrel roll down the front stretch ejecting the whole inner roll cage of the #92 car along with the driver threw the roof of the car,while the cage was rolling the driver was also ejected out of the seat,
Our thoughts and prayers are with Mike and his family

[Grlluvsdirtracin]

Carol,

Last night during the 4 cyl race one of the drivers got loose and rolled, In the middle of the pack with no where for the other cars to go he was hit while in the air and the car came apart...the roll cage came out driver and all. As Denise said the equipment was not up to par. It was by far the scariest thing I ever seen on a racetrack.

Michele

[carolwicks]

thank you denise...

mike will stay on my prayer list and please keep us informed...
carol

[fred23]

FOrgive me if this isn't the right place to say this.......I too hope Mike recovers fully.......but if you are thinking that the tracks are responsible for how peoples cars are built or what safety equipment they choose to buy and install, you are barking up the wrong tree. While I will agree there should be a safety check by the tech officials, which I know NSS and Orlando do; it is the sole responsibilty of the driver/owner/car builder when it comes to the safety and track worthiness of their racecar. Believe me, I have seen some SCARY!!!!!!!!!looking racecars that I would not get in to back off the trailer. IF safety is not your first concern as a racer you have some issues. the cliche "Good enough" should not apply when safety is the issue.

My father recently flipped his car. As they were trying to get him out of an upside down racecar, they were having a little trouble with his HANS device. One of the track workers looked at me and actually said " sometimes those things are more trouble than they are worth". I replied in not such a friendly tone..."he's talking to you isn't he". In my opinion, you cannot have enough safety built into your car.

[1wildfastgirl24]

FOrgive me if this isn't the right place to say this.......I too hope Mike recovers fully.......but if you are thinking that the tracks are responsible for how peoples cars are built or what safety equipment they choose to buy and install, you are barking up the wrong tree. While I will agree there should be a safety check by the tech officials, which I know NSS and Orlando do; it is the sole responsibilty of the driver/owner/car builder when it comes to the safety and track worthiness of their racecar. Believe me, I have seen some SCARY!!!!!!!!!looking racecars that I would not get in to back off the trailer. IF safety is not your first concern as a racer you have some issues. the cliche "Good enough" should not apply when safety is the issue.

My father recently flipped his car. As they were trying to get him out of an upside down racecar, they were having a little trouble with his HANS device. One of the track workers looked at me and actually said " sometimes those things are more trouble than they are worth". I replied in not such a friendly tone..."he's talking to you isn't he". In my opinion, you cannot have enough safety built into your car.

I agree with you 100%....No its not the tracks sole responsibilty for how a drivers car is built...Sorry if it sounded that way,I'm not anyway saying that it was the tracks fault for this happening,All I am saying is there is alot of amature drivers and people building alot of these cars and they have no clue on how to properly install & weld cages in the cars,The driver's should never cut corners on anything when it comes to safety on thier cars mainly roll cages,seat mounts and harnesses and etc...
How ever I do feel the tracks need to throughly safety check these cars before they get on the track with them to keep this kind of stuff from happening,no offense to the lower divisions but thats where alot of amature drivers are and people new to short track racing begin and they build thier own cars, thats fine and dandy if you know what you are doing and that you know how to weld and know not to use bolts and etc... to mount your cage with,Some people just have no clue on building a racecar safely and how serious the matter is,So all I was saying the tracks do need to look over these cars,thier officials knows what is safe and what is not,have the pit officials do belt checks while they are waiting in line up to go on the track,there could never be enough safety point checks at the track.and the worker that told you that the hans device are more trouble than what they are worth should have been fired from that track in my opinion.

My husband is volunteering to assist the track helping them safety inspect these cars to make sure these cages, seat mounts and harness belts are installed correctly,Because after last saturday night not only does tragic stuff like this happening effect the life of the driver of that car,but also the other drivers he is racing with, My 17 year old Son was racing in the same division and seen this all happen in front of him and was almost literaly in shock over it and is still upset over it by the images of it going over and over in his head,There was another driver that hit the car as it was rolling and all he was thinking was that his car done the most damage to Mikes car and he was blaming himself with it,which we was trying to assure him it was not his fault or anyone eles's it was just a bad racing accident.And I for one dont want to ever see anything like this happen again to anyone.
Like I said you are right and I agree with you about the drivers being more responsible to make sure thier car is safe.

[georgep]

This is not a LECTURE

Let us sit back and just take a deep breath. The Race track has a set of rules, They say that a car SHOULD be this type material or that size pipe. Then we have the sanctioning body who also has the same information but maybe a little different. Last of all we have the car builder. NOW we have the answer as to where all the safety MUST start.
The track, NO, why? They print rules don't they, yes BUT they do not BUILD the car. Sanctioning body, well they print rules, but again do not BUILD the car. NOW we get to the car builder. They build the car according to the printed rule to the BEST OF THEIR ABILITY. Sometimes the welder is not the best or the talent is not there to understand the proper way to do something like MOUNT BELTS or Attaching seats and cages.
What did I just type that it is all the BUILDERS FAULT NO!!!! It is the fault of anybody who does not ASK for help on any project that they are not an EXPERT in when it comes to the FOUNDATION OF SAFETY.
MANY.MANY years ago I sat in a diner with people from a BIG mid west body and the used that term. FOUNDATION OF SAFETY.
That is the FRAME, CAGE, SEAT, BELTS. You SECURE the CAGE TO THE FRAME, the seat TO THE FRAME and the LAP belts TO THE FRAME and the shoulder belts to the CAGE. Then the driver is held where he should be.
I am not saying that anyone did anything wrong but if you look at your car and the Foundation of Safety is not like that then you have a problem.
Every time a shunt happens and someone is hurt in ANYWAY we need to LEARN from that.
I hope Mike recovers but I am also worried about the other people who are having a mental problem over this. Mike was racing just like the other guys and he got in a shunt that turned real bad. I can understand the problems the other guys are having and it will take time for this to pass. Racing is a great hobby, sport or passion, pick one. But bad things happen and if you are as nutty about this as I am you want everybody to try and make it safer and better for all.

[Osmosis Jones]

Message Board 101......

This thread is a good example of what I like to see on a message board.

Other than the fact that a driver was hurt this is a good example of seeing a problem, recognizing the need for reform and then offering a mixture of possible causes along with well reasoned solutions for others consideration. And all without anybody getting hot under their keyboard and telling someone their stupid. I hope it can keep going this way. Thanks to everyone, so far.

My take on this type of situation is the buck stops with the driver him or herself. No one is holding a gun to their head to make them race a particular car. Anyone who straps into a car that will be rolling onto a track carries the responsibility to know what they are driving. If the driver is a minor, and by now people know how I feel about that, then it's the parents responsibility to make sure they have taken every safety precaution possible to prevent injury. That said, these are race cars and even a mini cup crash, given the right circumstances, could be devastating and possibly fatal. On the other hand, most incidents are minor and quickly overlooked.
Responsibility is being prepared for the worst so the minor stuff stays that way. Just minor stuff.

IMO the track's liability is based on their insurance premiums and how much they value the legal strength of their sign in sheet. In this day and age, given our environment of personal injury ambulance chasers, I would think a track's underwriter would require a full bumper to bumper check of every vehicle that pulled over the wall, race car or not. And they might just require that....I don't know. How many tracks that you have gone to have you sat there at the pit gate and read through the entire sign in sheets small print before you signed your acceptance of it? You want to believe that a track is going to have the very best rescue equipment on hand to save your butt if something were to go down but really, how many have gone over to the rescue truck(s) and asked about their training or experience? Have they ever worked an on track incident with high speed impact and a vehicle with construction unlike any they may have come across in their jobs as firefighters or paramedics? Do they have Hurst equipment and are they trained in its use? Do they carry a full trauma kit or just a small jump bag? A lot gets taken for granted each and every weekend all across the country. Again, the track is liable for the minimum required by their insurance carrier. The rest is up to the racers themselves. And given a long enough rope............

George, when you say "car builder" do you mean actual companies like Howe, Port City and Lefthander (just to name a few), or do you mean just the guy that builds a car to go racing? Because at most short tracks and in a lot of cases, that's the driver, owner and builder all in one. So most of the time the responsibility still comes down to the driver again. Especially in the support divisions where most aren't going to spend the money for someone else to build them a car. Hopefully at the very least, a racer will have an experienced fabricator install and weld-up his main cage for him. Hopefully. But even given that, how many different chassis have you seen roll cages evolve into as they are cut out of one and fitted into another? How can someone be sure of the history of the car they bought from a guy who races at another track? Lots and lots of little variables for why a cage may or may not be structurally sound anymore. Some that even an engineer might not notice given just a short visual check of the entire car.

Man.....sorry to go on so I'll stop now but to sum it up (IMHO) there are a lot of checks and balances for safety but in the end the most important link is the one between the seat and the steering wheel. He or she makes the decision to crawl through that window and pull over the hill.

I'm hoping the driver who was injured can make a full recovery and get to race again. I hate to see anybody get hurt in or around a race car.

Osmosis

[georgep]

This thread is a good example of what I like to see on a message board.


George, when you say "car builder" do you mean actual companies like Howe, Port City and Lefthander (just to name a few), or do you mean just the guy that builds a car to go racing? Because at most short tracks and in a lot of cases, that's the driver, owner and builder all in one. So most of the time the responsibility still comes down to the driver again. Especially in the support divisions where most aren't going to spend the money for someone else to build them a car. Hopefully at the very least, a racer will have an experienced fabricator install and weld-up his main cage for him. Hopefully. But even given that, how many different chassis have you seen roll cages evolve into as they are cut out of one and fitted into another? How can someone be sure of the history of the car they bought from a guy who races at another track? Lots and lots of little variables for why a cage may or may not be structurally sound anymore. Some that even an engineer might not notice given just a short visual check of the entire car.


Osmosis

Anybody who FABS on the safety Structure of the car.
If you want a real eye opener go to the New Jersey Department of Motor Vehicle and look under RACING. They got so pro active about safety they stepped in. If you buy a frame raced in that state and run on a track in that state it has been very well inspected.
If nothing else is gotten from this thread but that you need a WELL QUALIFY ED welder to build the safety structure then it was worth the time to type.
If you are not a certified welder and you want to weld on your car then build, push bars and such. DO not add or subtract to the cage.
One last thought, BOLTING IN a cage is just fine, as long as you WELD IT IN after bolting. The BOLTS are strong, but SHEAR, the mounting plate is only as goos as the weld that holds it to the frame rail.

[carolwicks]

great thread...great posts...

i agree with OJ... when something like this happens it is really a jolt to the sport... i agree that drivers need to take alot more responsibility for their safety and that means KNOWING they are in a safe car and equipped with up to date safety apparel etc....
too many people put too much responsibility on the track... everything in life is a learning experience and i sure hope at least a few people learned something from this.
OJ... you are a fireman and a racer. perhaps you could start a new thread and show us a list of the things every driver should check out during the week BEFORE they race... their lives depend on it...thanks...
carolwicks aka OZ

[Benny The Mule]

I wish this driver a speedy recovery.

No need for me to ramble too much because everyone on here so far have touched on all the issues.

The only thing i will add about the structural integrity of a car is, i retired a good OLD chassis i had because it was showing stress and detrerioration at the points where the main cage attached to the frame.

It was still a competitive car.

As George P mentioned, i don't (patch) roll cages.

My last and current chassis the cage was professionally built and installed including seat and belt brackets.......(i sent the new seat to the shop with the car to be fitted properly) and it really didn't cost me that much.

[HaudFan]

From today's Volusia News Journal:
September 09, 2008

Driver critical after crash at local track

By GODWIN KELLY
Motorsports Editor

DAYTONA BEACH -- Mike Corcoran had no pulse and was not breathing when Volusia Speedway Park emergency crew members came to the race driver's aid after a horrifying accident Saturday night at the half-mile dirt oval.

"He was laying there, in the track, no helmet, blood was pooling," said an infield eyewitness, who asked not to be identified. "I was watching his feet. They never moved."

Corcoran, a weekend racer from Holly Hill, was listed in critical condition at Halifax Medical Center on Monday night.

In what veteran race fans and competitors described as the most disturbing racing accident they have ever seen, Corcoran was ejected from his Pure Stock race car after a violent blow to the undercarriage of his car from another competitor.

According to various accounts, including a Volusia County Sheriff's incident report, Corcoran's racer went sideways off of Turn 4, barrel-rolled several times and came to rest on its roof.

Another race car slammed into Corcoran's racer, standing it up sideways on the passenger side, its underside exposed broadside to oncoming traffic.

Seconds later, a second, more powerful blow from another competitor gouged the roll cage from the car while ejecting Corcoran from the cockpit.

It was a hit so brutal, it knocked the helmet off the 38-year-old driver.

Corcoran's No. 92 race car was shattered, parts strewn across the front stretch.

"It shot the roll cage, seat and driver out of the car, with the roof attached," said the infield witness, a mechanic for a visiting race team.

Emergency personnel immediately worked to revive Corcoran, who witnesses said lost blood from a gash to the head. The sheriff's report said the injured driver "did not have a pulse and was not breathing."

EVAC soon joined the fight to save Corcoran's life. He was taken by helicopter to Halifax for treatment.

"They worked on him quite a while before they got him into the chopper," said the infield witness.

The Pure Stock division is an entry-level racing class featuring older model, four-cylinder street cars modified with basic safety equipment such as a simple roll cage.

Corcoran's racer was described as a small passenger car with "unibody" construction, a vehicle designed with little steel safety railing.

The accident happened on the last lap of the last race of Saturday night's racing program before several hundred spectators and competitors.

"You see guys crash out here, their cars come apart and they walk away," said a female witness, who watched the accident unfold from the grandstands near the start-finish line. "Not this time."

A VSP spokeswoman said all cards and other well-wish items for Corcoran and his family should be sent to Halifax.

[Frasson118]

I think the last time I saw someone EVAC'ed out, was also at Volusia. The Motorcycle Stunt guy (the name escapes me right now), who kind of went sideways off the launching ramp, and crashed on the landing side. He was pretty badly injured and spent a long time in the hospital.

His recovery period was updated from time to time here on Karnac, but haven't seen anything in a few years. Any word on him?

Lightbulb comes on: Sky Lundstrum?

[Grlluvsdirtracin]

Update from VSP website

Following a crash on Saturday night, Mike Corcoran, driver of the #92 4-Cyl Stock car, remains in critical condition at Halifax Medical Center. Please include Mike in your thoughts and prayers for a full and speedy recovery. You may address cards and letters for well wishes to Mike's attention at Volusia Speedway, 1500 E SR 40, DeLeon Springs, FL 32130 and we will see to it they are delivered to him and his family.