Desoto Modified Meeting in 2 Weeks In ST.Pete

[Tim]

Todd I think you are right about the competitive option. As an idea, begin the class as is this year on treaded tires with the rule for 09 being the crate motor. The motors will break or have problems and as for MOST modified motors (I know it's not all of them), the crate can be less costly than fixing the big motor. At the very least the driver can continue to get use out of their existing investment for the remainder of this year. Again it's just an idea.

I do believe there needs to be a motor rule in place for next year, be it crate or built. The only part that keeps me headed towards an enforced crate program is when you say the word build. Build them they will and for some, money is no problem. The IMCA rules were established for the competitors to keep each other honest through a claiming process. Somewhere along the lines in FL drivers stopped claiming motors. The rule is still there in the current rulebook, it was never removed or kept from being enforced at the local level to my knowledge (possible on a tour I don't know).

[polesitter61]

Citrus is indeed doing a tire test in a few weeks with a Goodyear treaded tire similar the the new sportsman tire they tested a couple of months ago. They sportsman test went real well the tire tire worked great.

The only real way to fix the modified (and soon the Super Late Models) is to go the the hard treaded racing tire. This will cost the racer less money and help bring those "20 cars" back to the track. The other thing this does at the same time is take care of the motor problem. Big motors will not be able to put the power to the ground on these tires. A less powerful motor will probably be faster every night and easier on tires. Hard tire solves both problems.

As mentioned above, crate motors will only make tires more important than they are right now. Even if they buy them from the track they are still going to have to be policed, probably more than they are now. Gaining 20hp on a 400hp motor is a big difference, where as gaining 20hp on a 600 hp motor is not. I think if you make the crate motors an option as well as running the harder treaded tire that it is a step in the right direction. Let the big motors or non crate motors run with a weight or LS penatly or give the crates a weight break. Only problem with giving the crates a break is the cars are so light to begin with it will be hard to get them much lighter and keep good percentages, better to penalize the non crate motors.

Time and place for the meeting yet? Some of us from Citrus would like to come down and take part.

My 2 cents

[oxms]

Harder Tires

The only reasonable and cost effective idea that has been posted is going to a harder tire.

I purchased an OWM in the off season with the idea of running it in the Extreme Series which has now been canceled. We made two of the three races at a cost of over $2,500 when you add tires, fuel, pit and entry fees, food and travel. I had to put a new engine in it before the Lakeland race because we blew up at NSS in practice. So the chances of my throwing more money away on another engine to race half way across the state are zero. Now if all I have to do is detune the engine to put out less hp to accommodate a different tire that will last two three of even four races then I'm up for that but anything else you can forget it.

[Benny The Mule]

better to penalize the non crate motors?



As i posted before, ride height, body dimentions,weight , maximum xxx c.i. rules and allow ANY,ANY, ANY motor, just put them on hard tires. As soon as you say "penalize" or "break" it drives potential cars away in huge #'s. Give em their big motors, small motors and the rules i stated above (the way mods used to be) Driver + set-up fastest car wins! I't wouldn't be a money game anymore.

[pintodave]

I feel like a broken record.

Treaded tires, Iron heads.

If you want to get real liberal, go to the grooved tire in 2008, then give everyone almost a full YEAR to switch to the iron heads (heck we just bought BRAND NEW alum. heads for this year).

The only thing I hate about crate motors is the guys w/ big money can still cheat. So what are we all buying the same motor for if someone can still cheat?? Leave the open motor rules, but make them iron heads. Or like I said in a previous post, BAN the 18 deg. heads.

Nothing like someone showing up with a used craftsman truck motor to make you feel like you shouldnt have even bothered showing up...

[calres22]

The only reasonable and cost effective idea that has been posted is going to a harder tire.

I purchased an OWM in the off season with the idea of running it in the Extreme Series which has now been canceled. We made two of the three races at a cost of over $2,500 when you add tires, fuel, pit and entry fees, food and travel. I had to put a new engine in it before the Lakeland race because we blew up at NSS in practice. So the chances of my throwing more money away on another engine to race half way across the state are zero. Now if all I have to do is detune the engine to put out less hp to accommodate a different tire that will last two three of even four races then I'm up for that but anything else you can forget it.

I race up in ohio, and I won last weekend with tires that are 5 weeks old. You think I might throw new tires on next week? Nah. These hard treaded tires last forever. I can post pictures of my tires with spray can marks from qualifying every week, and you will see a bunch of marks on them. Still working just fine.

[Simple Man]

Going extinct

Let the racers run any motor they want to. Just have a motor claim. $800.00 and no swap. Run the treaded tires. This worked well for IMCA. It worked well at several tracks and the claim was $325.00 Shocks were claimed at $50.00. Jax Raceways had 20 to 25 cars every week until they let the three or four LOUD MOUTHS ruin it for every one. They had more money than sense. It was great for them but killed the class...........If nothing else, go to the treaded tire like the G60. If you can't hook it up, why spend the money to have it. Harder tire means it want wear out as fast. Less money to spend on tires............Racers with lots of money are like liberials. Its about them and to hell with ever one else.

[pintodave]

Racers with lots of money are like liberials. Its about them and to hell with ever one else.

bwhahaha...

...and they dont live in the real world!

[ovalracer44]

It seems to amaze me that you and frasson that don't race have all the ans.

I dont race? Are you off your rocker there grumpy. I have run at your track in the past. The way you treat people is the reason for your struggles now. Go ahead and lie in your own pool of piss now.

[flraceguy]

You know..

I hate to put my two darn cents in to this conversation when I am not racing the series... BUT... Please don't make it prohibitive to the drivers... The drivers and lots of them are what make and pays the track bills... I raced for a long time and would love to be back turning left.. But due to a divorce and a job change I can't come back in this year.... Now enough of the sappy stuff... Rule changes are fine, BUT give people time to afford such rule changes... PLEASE.... Unless I am just silly the economic times are pretty tough for alot of people... Drivers, car owners, track owners, and promoters included... I am not intiment in all the details of this rule change, but from what I have read it seems that the promoter/track owner/series head is trying to drive away car count.. .

Speaking from old times, run the hard treaded tires and funny thing, alot of the horsepower advantage IS GONE... can't stick, can't win...

Have a great night all...

Duane
386-569-4059

[Egoracing]

Just have a motor claim. $800.00 and no swap. Run the treaded tires. This worked well for IMCA.

There are $13,000+ MOTORS in IMCA modifieds where there is a $500 claim rule. Desoto used to have a $500 claim rule. If you were not over 380ci, Aluminum heads and VERY light rotating assy you were not up front against the Yates, Childress and Klein motors that were running. Claim's don't work.

Put them all on the same tire, HARD.
1. Open motors, No Spoiler and 2600lbs with 100 in front on the cross member.
2. 362 ci max motors aluminum heads no spoiler and 2500lbs with 50 on front cross member.
3. 362 ci max All Iron motors with flat tappet cams 4 inch spoiler and 2450lbs
4. GM 602 & 604 Crate Engine 8 inch spoiler and 2400lbs.
Anything outside of the rules of any class puts you into the next class IE... Iron 355 engine but roller cam you are in weight class #1.
NO Tolerance on spoilers PERIOD.
ANY class of car showing an advantage will be assesed a rules change. This will be based on a majority of the car type NOT one driver.
Engines will be pulled APART and tech-ed Randomly NOT just the top cars. Any cars found illegal will loose illegal parts and receive a suspension from the track for ALL classes for one year. If caught cheating inside the bolts on a crate engine you will be suspended for 365 days minimum and NOT be allowed to run a crate engine in ANY class in the future.

[modracer22]

How many times do we the racers have to say put us on hard tires that will even up the field with the racer having to spend nothing but a new set of tires. If youlook on the internet and do a search on asphalt mod series the ones that drawl good car counts have no motor rules basically run what have and bolt on a hard tire and race. There are no weight breaks for any motor and they have good car counts at every show. Also there payout is really no better then are series pay but they alot more to start.

[canedogs06]

hard treads is the way to go. If all tracks jumped on board you would see the car counts grow. I would like to run at Auburndale this weekend but cant afford too this weekend, so we will have to wait until June 14th. Make us run slicks and we are there every week. no crates no motor rules needed

[Simple Man]

The answer is so simple!!!

I mean no disrespect Egoracing. Your solution sounds like Hillary or Obama. To many rules to enforce. To many changes to current cars. Get home at 4am, Etc. I'm sorry. This has happend to the dirt cars as well. I know when the "Now CLOSED Jax Raceways" ran and stuck with the IMCA rules, they had plenty of cars every week. The economy was realivant to the time period. But there were at least 8-9-10 cars that could win each week. What was the beginning of the end was when the track allowed the tire rule to change. And yes the track sold the tires. The next thing was spoilers. Then they made it almost impossible to claim a motor. This allowed bigger motors, less chance of differnt winners and a drastic loss of car counts. They tried to appese the big mouths who had plenty of mony. Before the rule changes, we had only $1200 in our motors. And two championships. No one wants to go to the track to be an "also ran." At least not me. I go to win!!!. I can not afford to $5000 for a motor. But I do buy a new tire almost evey week. (Switched to Hobby Stock. Modified in garage under tarp) It would not hurt me to buy four new treaded tires. And yes you can get several weeks out of the right side...........I'm all for the claim rule and they do work if the track doesn't interfere. But the very least go to the treaded tire. The Hooiser G 60 is only about $90 to $95.

[Egoracing]

The formula is working, Look at the United Dirt Late Model Challenge Series. A 200-250hp difference between cars and ALL of them, 362 aluminum head motors on alcohol, Iron limited engines and Crate engines have all lead and been in contention to win races. They have ran 5 races and have had over 110 drivers, averaged over 45 cars a race and are averaging over 30 series members a race. NO series is doing that good ANYWHERE PERIOD.
Why are they doing this good, simple, they looked at all of the different rules that the tracks in the area run and made it where anyone can run the series with minimal changes. Take ALL of the modified rules in the state and make it where ANY of them can run and win and you will have full fields. In the rules no one has to buy anything to change on there cars, only weight and add or remove weight.