end of the Extreme Modified series

[DeMan951]

Without giving away who, the guy I was with said they got a motor in the low $20K range then changed a bunch of things and ended up spending over $30K on the motor and still was getting out motored at USA by a couple of drivers. So no I am not full of it. The finally had enough and went to a different series with a sealed motor rule. I hate seeing the end of this series just as much as you do Jane it is very sad.

[eagletai]

Nice!

it's sad that this has happen..... But after being in Florida and watching this series for years it seems as if the promoters rode this series into the ground just like the ole cowboy riding that nuke missile to the ground in that movie....

I feel for the drivers, dont care for the freakin terrible promoters and the other series should take notice of what these people are about: Themselves!! bottom line, the all mighty dollar and when they cant get promoter savy they just shut it down nice!!!

To the Promoters of this Series, DON N and all the people with a say in this series over the years SEE what your decisions have yeilded, Bunch of Idiots.

The long term vision of this series it seems was at the end of their nose instead of down the road!!!

They ran this series like they ran Orlando/NSS what a trainwreck..

[JackTripper]

For the most part this has been a fairly healthy discussion.

You'd like to think that between 3-4 of the people in this thread SOMEONE could come up with a good sensible package for the modifieds. If the prior leadership of the TBARA could run a successful winged sprint car club, why can't there be a successful pavement modified club with an elected leader and such?

[Scooter71]

I Race a modified and have for the past 4 years. We got into modifieds because we liked what we saw with the traveling series. We have traveled with the Gulfcoast series for the past 2 seasons. No we did not make every race but we did make all the ones that time and money would allow. I have always wanted to run Lakeland but last weekend we chose to stay at home. Our reasoning for this was we have a motor pushing around 480 hp. We didn't see the benefit in traveling 3 hours one way, with the cost of fuel, buying tires for the race, entry fee for the race, fuel for the car, and pit passes, to go out and run against motors pushing between 6 - 700 horses. Instead we chose to sit that out and race at Citrus this weekend where I know we will be competitive, this is still a 2 1/2 hour drive but it is the fact of knowing you have a better chance of winning and running up front. I did not want to see the series end either, we hate running at only one track but we can't travel as often as we used to and we have to pick our races a little more wisely these days. I would love to see the Gulf Coast motor guys have a race at Lakeland it may not be the speeds ya'll ran last week but I bet the racing would be better. My 2 cents may be bias because I have 3 Gulf Coast motors but alot of my racing buddies on the West coast still do as well. Don't beat me up on this too bad just wanted to tell our reasoning for staying home. Not crying about the big SB2 motor and whatever else is out there but I have what I have and for know I will stick to CCMP and Citrus.

[Frasson118]

Skip... Thanks for the kind words. Would also like to meet you soon.

As someone who has zero dollars invested in this program, I don't have any influence on decisions. But as a race fan, especially Modifieds, I know it can and SHOULD be better than it is. I hope it returns to the class it was meant to be.

[modracer22]

Scooter 71 no ones on here to beat anybody up but like you I have only a good open motor and a not so good open motor that I ran for years until I save anough money to get a open motor. I still ran my small motor against the open 18 degree stuff and won a few races. You can be competetive at orlando with a small motor but like you I still have to pick my races I made all 3 of the extreme races to try and support the series and had 3 bad finishes so didn't make anything back. The problem with the mods and its not so much the motor because you could add or take away track to help everyone so no one thinks they can't win or run up front.
The problem is the payout or lack of and no track support and what i mean by that is that when the series comes to the track. Get your local driver to race and give them regular points for the night just like a regular show. Also with everything going up try to pay more or atleast not make it so top heavy the guy that finish 10 tried as hard and probally spent as much money as the winner will be lucky to get 200 bucks. In the big picture thats the way racing as become winner take all. I would think that 200 to take the green is more like it not 75. I would bet this by its self will increase the car count. I'm not looking at making money at this but when you spend between everything 700 to 1000 to race and they hand you 75 bucs because you had a bad night or whatever you can't do that very long until you just give up.

[brokebackmike45]

How can you have a series when there are only 5-6 modifieds that run on Friday and Saturday nights? They only run a few races the whole year and last I looked Orlando had none running in June. I think that if you’re going to run a series you need to run with a class that produces a large amount of cars weekly. Fascar ought to have crate motors, 2500lb rule, for modifieds and a fast modified class for the current ones. If they were to have a crate motor rule im sure there would be more modifieds .They might be just a little slower but make for some exciting racing. Fascar should look into this for next year starting now and not waiting until March 15th next year. Basically it would be like a superstock class but with a modified body. It seems like the guys that come out every week to run the modifieds have the money to do it. They keep the current class going and I appreciate them doing it. The modifieds are one of the best classes that I like to watch.
There also needs to be some relief at the stands. It’s crazy when a family of 5 have to pay 100.00 to get in during special races. There should be some kind of discount. The track charges are why the people are not coming to the races anymore along with the struggling economy. I remember last year when the drivers handed out tickets for one of the events the stands were full. My question is did speedworld make money off the food? I would go back and look at the books for that night and if so do it more often.

[modracer22]

I don't really disagree with the create motor rule mods but once again you will split the class of cars that doesn't have anough cars anyways. I wish I new what the problem is and how to fix it because I really like the modifieds and love driving them. Even from what I've heard they are also hurting on the west coast also for car counts in the mods and this is just what I've heard.
Other places in the country they have healthy car counts in the mods and the traveling series also has good car counts. Some run create motors and others it's run what you brung. I will continue to try and do something to help the mods and bring some bigger races and hopefully stronger car counts. Wondering if a weight penilty for the open motors would help and not the 200 pds that the gulf coast had or a chip or something along them lines so no one has to spend anymore money and can run what they have.

[calres22]

You guys want to know what it takes to have a successful modified class, listen up!!!
1. Rock hard tire
2. 2400lb minimum weight
3. rock hard tire
4. no motor rule
5. rock hard tire
6. 58% left side weight
7. you guessed it, rock hard tire.

I currently run in Ohio but used to run the SARA series back aroud 2002. We had small motors, but soft tires. The people who could afford it put 4 new on every week, and finished up front.

Up here in ohio, the rules i have mentioned earlier are what we have. I have, lets see........ right around $2500-3000 in my motor. No, I am not missing a 0, that price is correct. People I race with do have large motors, around the 15k dollar range that was spoken of before. Am i competitive with my little motor? Yes. Do they have any idea how small my motor is, dont think so. With the hard tires we have, I am able to get in the gas sooner than anyone else without spinning the tires. Plus the tires last a lot longer. Last season, I averaged 6 races on the right sides. 7 on the left rear, and the left front ran the entire season. Putting on new tires makes you faster by about .1 seconds, on a track where we are qualifying around the low 14's. And you lose that advantage after about 5 laps. So far this year I have won half of the races, so little motors do run as fast as the bigger ones. The only track up here where i might get out motored a little is winchester, but its not by much.

Right now we are averaging about 20-22 cars a week, which is a little low due to the nasty weather we have had here recently. But the racing is competitive, you can run any motor combination you want, one guy is running a 427+ c.i. motor, and it does come down to car setup and the driver. Is my driving ability making up for the small motor, no.

This is just my proposal. You will see more cars come out since any motor can run, people are spending less on tires and can actually afford to come out. Is there a track out there brave enough to try this? If you want, I might be willing to tow down there if you let me run with my motor, my rules, my tires.

[Dana Barlow]

lots of car for a class

ROCK HARD tires,yes,but they need to be wide (10in. or +)not little crap,that even makes rock hard go bad fast,plus cars look like crap on skinny tires. Cars that run side by side,most need to feel they have a shot at winning at lest a heat=never start fast cars on the front and allways have slower cars in one of the heats=give them a win to brag about or they stop coming,so field gets small.
Make a gear rule(for about 6500rpm)=EZ to check and holds more even HP,crate motors are not the rite trick,but carb size limet is [500 cfm],carbs,engine size,and gear are EZ checked,other stuff is hard to check=dose not get done enough.
2cents

[calres22]

ROCK HARD tires,yes,but they need to be wide (10in. or +)not little crap,that even makes rock hard go bad fast,plus cars look like crap on skinny tires. Cars that run side by side,most need to feel they have a shot at winning at lest a heat=never start fast cars on the front and allways have slower cars in one of the heats=give them a win to brag about or they stop coming,so field gets small.
Make a gear rule(for about 6500rpm)=EZ to check and holds more even HP,crate motors are not the rite trick,but carb size limet is [500 cfm],carbs,engine size,and gear are EZ checked,other stuff is hard to check=dose not get done enough.
2cents

Tend to disagree with you a little bit. Bigger tires are not the answer. The point of rock hard tires is to limit the amount of horsepower they can handle before you just start spinning them. Secondly, if you limit rpms, gear and carb size, you now get guys bulding torquer motors and lots of focus is put on the carb to get the most out of it. let the people run big motors, but limit how much of the motor can get to the ground
I do agree with you on splitting the field for the heats. Take the top half, run them in first heat but invert entire field. The bottom half run second heat, once again inverting the entire field. It does give everyone a more even chance of winning at least a heat race.

These arent just some crazy ideas that I am coming up with, these are ideas that are being used where I race and the ideas are working.

[modracer22]

I'm for the treaded tire but a lot of the drivers arn't and you can't get it through there head that motor won't count with the treaded tire. Like I said in earlier posts and I agree smaller carb on the open motors is not the cure all but its a start or something along them lines. I've been to the usa modified series web site a lot. Wow talk about car count and nice race tracks on the schedule. I would like to know what is the pay out is. Also see that shady bowl as a really good car count also. I know the mods can be a great class just have to quit fighting each other over rules and find some common ground. Thanks for everyones imput because as I stated earlier I will do everything I can to try and get this deal off the ground again.

[calres22]

I'm for the treaded tire but a lot of the drivers arn't and you can't get it through there head that motor won't count with the treaded tire. Like I said in earlier posts and I agree smaller carb on the open motors is not the cure all but its a start or something along them lines. I've been to the usa modified series web site a lot. Wow talk about car count and nice race tracks on the schedule. I would like to know what is the pay out is. Also see that shady bowl as a really good car count also. I know the mods can be a great class just have to quit fighting each other over rules and find some common ground. Thanks for everyones imput because as I stated earlier I will do everything I can to try and get this deal off the ground again.

I ran shadybowl earlier this year, just to test the car out, and I agree, the car counts are awesome. The USA modifieds started by steve ellis run the rules that I have stated above in a previous post. Look at their car counts and you will see this formula works. The payouts for a weekly non-traveling series is about 550-600 to win, 100 to show up. Another thing i forgot about rules wise is no mirrors and no radios. The only radio you are allowed to have and it is mandated is the Raceceiver that is used by the Legends cars. keeps you from having to spend money on a set of radios. Race director tells you when and where cautions are and your line up during the yellow. Speeds up the show as well which fans love.
Wow! rules that benefit the driver/owner, make for more exciting racing and the fans like it better. And you wonder why racing is going downhill in florida.

[pintodave]

Blah blah blah... so much talking...

Keep it simple.

Treaded tires, no 18 deg heads, and make the heads cast iron while you are at it. 7 lbs per C.I.? No. If its not a 358 or smaller, it doesnt race. These god-forsaken motor rules have worked out ok for IMCA.

Maybe ALL of the asphalt promoters will get tired of not making any money and go "Gee whiz this isnt working, lets all adopt a similar set of competative rules like all of those dirt track guys are doing, maybe we can increase the car counts..."

I watched all of this same stuff unfold years ago with the mini-stocks. I remember the FMSC events pulling 45 cars at NSS. Then someone shows up with the baddest tube-chassis car that, if you read the rules, should be illegal. It is allowed to race, then the next time someone else has to build one to keep up... and the game continues...

Lack of communication still seems to be paramount also. Everyone knows that there will be a shortage of stock clips for these cars at some point. So then tube clips will be allowed. Or was it for next season? Or was that with a weight penalty? Depends who you ask... Blah blah... everything changes by the month because there is no standard for it to not be changed.

So who wants to start side bets that by the end of summer time of 2008 there will be no definative answers or cooperation by any promoters to make a (somewhat) permanent set of logical and STABLE rules to help promote the overall HEALTH of the modified division, or heck any asphalt division for that matter... I actually hope I'm wrong and would be happy to lose 10 bucks...

[Scooter71]

We raced at Citrus this past weekend. The twin races there normally pull in 20 to 30 cars this weekend we had 12. It was also said before the race in the modified meeting that they would allow any tire to come and race there. A car from another track would not have to run Goodyears you can run whatever tire you have. (8 inch) It was also stated they were going to do a test with a couple of modifieds on treaded tires to see if there is a big difference in speed or handling. I commend the folks at Citrus for looking for ways to build there car counts and trying to lower the cost of racing there. I have no problem with treaded tires if they are more durable and you don't have to replace every week to be competitive.